Joan Baez Warns Americans Not to Lose Their 'Dictator-Phobia' Under Trump

Folk icon Joan Baez warned Americans not to lose their dictator-phobia under President Donald Trump, saying the administration's cruelty marks a shift that will make dissent riskier in the years ahead. Baez spoke on The Best People with Nicolle Wallace, the MSNBC podcast hosted by Wallace, framing social change as inseparable from courage in a period she described as scarier than any she has known.

Baez contrasted the current moment with her own youth, noting that she was jailed twice for aiding and abetting draft resistance during the anti-Vietnam War era. She said that then we had our lawyers, we had the call, we had the families come visit, we had our medication; today the first order of the day for this group is cruelty. She added that today they not only cage people but love putting people in cages, and she said she has never experienced anything like the present political climate.

Wallace asked why Americans think someone else will save the country, and why business leaders aren’t fighting back harder, given the common refrain that no autocracy thrives where the economy is strong. Baez cited Curtis Yarvin, the former Silicon Valley programmer who has argued that democracy should be abolished in favor of a national CEO. The first thing that comes to my mind is one of Elon Musk’s little puppet people on TV, saying we gotta get over this dictator-phobia, she said. And it’s what’s really evolving now. People are getting over their dictator-phobia.

Baez’s remarks underscore a broader concern about the resilience of civil liberties and the willingness of citizens to take risks to challenge power in a political environment that some observers say rewards conformity. The interview underscores how cultural figures have engaged with current topics in U.S. politics, and it arrives amid ongoing debates over how dissent and protest are treated in the Trump era.

Baez offered a grim but instructive anecdote about a Turkish friend who has lived under dictatorship for years. She described the friend as having the only progressive newspaper that still existed as time went by, and she recalled asking for help. “Help,” Baez said she asked, “Why are you not in jail?” The friend replied, “Because I am very clever.” Baez acknowledged she is not as clever, but the friend has walked that line. “But she gets very depressed, because Turkey is this wonderful place … it’s been diminished, one thing after another. But it remains to be seen if I can be very clever.”

This reflection illustrates the fear and resilience Baez says underpin political life in oppressive environments, and she argues that social change requires risk-taking even when the path forward feels increasingly daunting. In closing, she reiterated her view that the country’s current trajectory will demand greater courage from ordinary people who choose to challenge authority rather than wait for a savior to appear.